WarpedKid02
01-01-2003, 12:57 PM
Posted by Mike Zamarocy (From PBNation)
Angel Bot Test Today
Ok, this was a quick preliminary test I was able to make today. I hope this cut & paste comes out ok. I shot 10 shots of XS Sports #1 balls, which though the last time I used a hopper of them they shot great, this time they were not as good. But I used the same balls from the same batch in every shot. I did a barrel test with a number of the balls, and not one fell right through, they fit fine, and was able to blow them out of the barrel. Same with the .689 Check-It Dragon 2 piece barrel I used for the accuracy test after the FPS test.
The temp was around 65, I used the stock Infinity 2001 LCD barrel (as most have that as opposed to various other brands) with my MacDev Gladiator reg adjusted to get the stock bolt to as near a constant 285 (field limit) as possible.
WDP - stock Angel Venturi
GTC - GT Cyclone
ST - Shocktech
LT - AKA Lightning
BB - Bonebrake
CO - Cobra
DZV - DeZign Venturi
DZOF - DeZign Open Face
FPS Sorted by shot order
WDP GTC ST-- LT-- BB CO DZV DZOF
285 276 293 294 278 301 296 298
283 279 286 293 276 300 299 298
291 281 282 289 287 289 295 295
266 285 290 293 295 285 298 299
283 278 290 298 290 297 289 299
287 279 274 298 295 285 286 293
285 274 293 291 287 296 289 295
276 286 279 292 287 298 298 298
279 278 288 293 292 291 294 294
287 277 286 282 297 299 293 284
FPS sorted by consistency
WDP GTC ST-- LT-- BB CO DZV DZOF
291 286 293 298 297 301 299 299
287 285 293 298 295 300 298 299
287 281 290 294 295 299 298 298
285 279 290 293 292 298 296 298
285 279 288 293 290 297 295 298
283 278 286 293 287 296 294 295
283 278 286 292 287 291 293 295
279 277 282 291 287 289 289 294
276 276 279 289 278 285 289 293
266 274 274 282 276 285 286 284
Average FPS
WDP GTC ST LT-- BB-- CO DZV DZOF
282 279 286 292 288 294 293 295
As you can see, under sort by shots (recorded as I took each shot), both DeZign bolts right off the bat were very consistent. And under sort by consistency, both DeZign and the Cobra bolts had the closest FPS. As for individual FPS gains, the Cobra was the highest, though not by much, with DeZign, Bonebrake, and the Lighting being very close to it. Nowhere near the exaggerated claims I have seen in other post of over 25 FPS gains over the stock bolt! But still some gain. But the averages make the DeZign Open Face the BEST of the crowd.
Now, as it was getting late (and dark), I had two tourney players who use modified Angels as their normal guns test out the bolts in a "BLIND" taste (accuracy) test. In other words, I did not tell them what bolts I put in the gun, in no particular order, and handed it over to them to test out at the shooting range. They shot at targets in different ranges. We used the Check-It 14" Dragon 2 piece barrel, as it was tried and agreed upon (using the stock bolt) that it was a much better barrel than the stock Infinity. This was not done on a bench, nor was I able to measure groupings. But it was used in sort of a real world "seat of the pants" target shooting - so might apply better than just a sterile setup. The order was kinda surprising of choice - from best to worse:
DeZign Open Face
DeZign Venturi
Lightning
Cobra
GT Cyclone (was commented that it really was not to bad at all!)
Bonebrake (was commented that it seemed to curve the ball DOWN!!)
Stock Bolt
Shocktech (surprising it was LAST!)
Now, some comments on the bolts in relation to fit & finish, as well as wear after use:
Both DeZign and Bonebrake bolts are made of ERTAlyte. Both DeZign bolts showed NO wear at all! Not even where it went up against the ball detent. But Dez has machined in a nice sloped edge on his bolt that he said was to help the passing over the detent as smooth as possible, and I think it worked. The Bonebrake showed just a few tiny marks on its side. The Cobra showed a few scratches as well, but not bad. The GT, Shocktech, and stock bolt showed a bit more wear scratches, but still acceptable. But the Lightning seems to have had its face end pretty scrubbed - might not be too good there, though it does pass the slide tapping in the bore test with no friction to be felt.
As for the feed holes, Cobra has the closest to a circle and smallest sized, GT a bit larger, Shocktech still a circle but larger yet. Lightning comes next with a slight oblong (cause of its famous "ramp" to curve the air), with the Bonebrake elongated a bit more, and the DeZign bolts the longest oblong hole.
As for the face holes, Cobra is the smallest, then GT Cyclone a bit more (but reason is what is inside, more later). The Lightning opens it up quite a bit but with a indent for the ball to lay against, as does the next larger DeZign Open Face. But the Bonebrake has the largest opening. The Shocktech has 3 Venturi holes, and the DeZign Venturi has 10 small outer ring holes and a bit larger middle hole.
The interior of some of these bolts are quite interesting. The Lightning has the cut ramp in it, which many know is its best LP feature in the AutoCocker bolt design. The Shocktech has a metal insert that has a bit of a ramp, but as its recessed towards the back a bit, doubt it does anything. The GT Cyclone is a weird one. It has a large piece of metal inside it that blocks a lot of the inlet hole, and forces the air around it, and then through the twisted venturi path that is at the end of this piece of metal. Supposedly this gives a "cyclone" effect to the air behind the ball. The 2 DeZign bolts have a ramped black plastic (might be ERTAlyte) ramp in them, similar to the Shocktech (also used to hold the ADJUSTABLE pin - yes, you CAN adjust it for the perfect hammer fit!), but much better as its placed where it can effect the air, but also angled much better to really direct the flow of air too. The Bonebrake and Cobra just have a 90 degree cut in them.
Lastly, the actual quality of the machining of the product. The outside of the Lightning seems well made (but- remember the bad amount of wear on it!), but the inside of it seems like it was very poorly cut! Lots of rough surface! The Shocktech, as usual, has a lots of flash inside it where the venturi holes were cut. This could cause some turbulence perhaps? But not quality workmanship if you ask me! The Cobra, Bonebrake, GT Cyclone, and both DeZign bolts all had excellent workmanship on them! Very well made. But the star once again seems to go to the DeZign bolts for those extra "little" touches put into them. The chamfered edges (for the detent), the adjustable pin, the machining, and even a slight "cut" between the lip and just before the feed hole. Not to slight the Bonebrake or Cobra, but the DeZign bolts just show a bit "more".
Oh, I did try the WDP "Custom" bolt for a day - and returned it the next. It was WORSE than the stock bolt! And at NPS I had the guy there try the KAPP Diamond bolt - the darn pin BROKE OFF inside his gun! If you take a look at these, there are already stress cracks where the pin is in the body. These are not Delrin or ERTAlyte bolts, but some sort of polymer.
So, in conclusion, it seems that the DeZign bolts, though not as LP as the Cobra, was more consistent with its FPS per shot, and in the "blind" taste test, was the most liked. The Open Face the top, with his Venturi a close second.
Hope this helps you folks . . . .
Angel Bot Test Today
Ok, this was a quick preliminary test I was able to make today. I hope this cut & paste comes out ok. I shot 10 shots of XS Sports #1 balls, which though the last time I used a hopper of them they shot great, this time they were not as good. But I used the same balls from the same batch in every shot. I did a barrel test with a number of the balls, and not one fell right through, they fit fine, and was able to blow them out of the barrel. Same with the .689 Check-It Dragon 2 piece barrel I used for the accuracy test after the FPS test.
The temp was around 65, I used the stock Infinity 2001 LCD barrel (as most have that as opposed to various other brands) with my MacDev Gladiator reg adjusted to get the stock bolt to as near a constant 285 (field limit) as possible.
WDP - stock Angel Venturi
GTC - GT Cyclone
ST - Shocktech
LT - AKA Lightning
BB - Bonebrake
CO - Cobra
DZV - DeZign Venturi
DZOF - DeZign Open Face
FPS Sorted by shot order
WDP GTC ST-- LT-- BB CO DZV DZOF
285 276 293 294 278 301 296 298
283 279 286 293 276 300 299 298
291 281 282 289 287 289 295 295
266 285 290 293 295 285 298 299
283 278 290 298 290 297 289 299
287 279 274 298 295 285 286 293
285 274 293 291 287 296 289 295
276 286 279 292 287 298 298 298
279 278 288 293 292 291 294 294
287 277 286 282 297 299 293 284
FPS sorted by consistency
WDP GTC ST-- LT-- BB CO DZV DZOF
291 286 293 298 297 301 299 299
287 285 293 298 295 300 298 299
287 281 290 294 295 299 298 298
285 279 290 293 292 298 296 298
285 279 288 293 290 297 295 298
283 278 286 293 287 296 294 295
283 278 286 292 287 291 293 295
279 277 282 291 287 289 289 294
276 276 279 289 278 285 289 293
266 274 274 282 276 285 286 284
Average FPS
WDP GTC ST LT-- BB-- CO DZV DZOF
282 279 286 292 288 294 293 295
As you can see, under sort by shots (recorded as I took each shot), both DeZign bolts right off the bat were very consistent. And under sort by consistency, both DeZign and the Cobra bolts had the closest FPS. As for individual FPS gains, the Cobra was the highest, though not by much, with DeZign, Bonebrake, and the Lighting being very close to it. Nowhere near the exaggerated claims I have seen in other post of over 25 FPS gains over the stock bolt! But still some gain. But the averages make the DeZign Open Face the BEST of the crowd.
Now, as it was getting late (and dark), I had two tourney players who use modified Angels as their normal guns test out the bolts in a "BLIND" taste (accuracy) test. In other words, I did not tell them what bolts I put in the gun, in no particular order, and handed it over to them to test out at the shooting range. They shot at targets in different ranges. We used the Check-It 14" Dragon 2 piece barrel, as it was tried and agreed upon (using the stock bolt) that it was a much better barrel than the stock Infinity. This was not done on a bench, nor was I able to measure groupings. But it was used in sort of a real world "seat of the pants" target shooting - so might apply better than just a sterile setup. The order was kinda surprising of choice - from best to worse:
DeZign Open Face
DeZign Venturi
Lightning
Cobra
GT Cyclone (was commented that it really was not to bad at all!)
Bonebrake (was commented that it seemed to curve the ball DOWN!!)
Stock Bolt
Shocktech (surprising it was LAST!)
Now, some comments on the bolts in relation to fit & finish, as well as wear after use:
Both DeZign and Bonebrake bolts are made of ERTAlyte. Both DeZign bolts showed NO wear at all! Not even where it went up against the ball detent. But Dez has machined in a nice sloped edge on his bolt that he said was to help the passing over the detent as smooth as possible, and I think it worked. The Bonebrake showed just a few tiny marks on its side. The Cobra showed a few scratches as well, but not bad. The GT, Shocktech, and stock bolt showed a bit more wear scratches, but still acceptable. But the Lightning seems to have had its face end pretty scrubbed - might not be too good there, though it does pass the slide tapping in the bore test with no friction to be felt.
As for the feed holes, Cobra has the closest to a circle and smallest sized, GT a bit larger, Shocktech still a circle but larger yet. Lightning comes next with a slight oblong (cause of its famous "ramp" to curve the air), with the Bonebrake elongated a bit more, and the DeZign bolts the longest oblong hole.
As for the face holes, Cobra is the smallest, then GT Cyclone a bit more (but reason is what is inside, more later). The Lightning opens it up quite a bit but with a indent for the ball to lay against, as does the next larger DeZign Open Face. But the Bonebrake has the largest opening. The Shocktech has 3 Venturi holes, and the DeZign Venturi has 10 small outer ring holes and a bit larger middle hole.
The interior of some of these bolts are quite interesting. The Lightning has the cut ramp in it, which many know is its best LP feature in the AutoCocker bolt design. The Shocktech has a metal insert that has a bit of a ramp, but as its recessed towards the back a bit, doubt it does anything. The GT Cyclone is a weird one. It has a large piece of metal inside it that blocks a lot of the inlet hole, and forces the air around it, and then through the twisted venturi path that is at the end of this piece of metal. Supposedly this gives a "cyclone" effect to the air behind the ball. The 2 DeZign bolts have a ramped black plastic (might be ERTAlyte) ramp in them, similar to the Shocktech (also used to hold the ADJUSTABLE pin - yes, you CAN adjust it for the perfect hammer fit!), but much better as its placed where it can effect the air, but also angled much better to really direct the flow of air too. The Bonebrake and Cobra just have a 90 degree cut in them.
Lastly, the actual quality of the machining of the product. The outside of the Lightning seems well made (but- remember the bad amount of wear on it!), but the inside of it seems like it was very poorly cut! Lots of rough surface! The Shocktech, as usual, has a lots of flash inside it where the venturi holes were cut. This could cause some turbulence perhaps? But not quality workmanship if you ask me! The Cobra, Bonebrake, GT Cyclone, and both DeZign bolts all had excellent workmanship on them! Very well made. But the star once again seems to go to the DeZign bolts for those extra "little" touches put into them. The chamfered edges (for the detent), the adjustable pin, the machining, and even a slight "cut" between the lip and just before the feed hole. Not to slight the Bonebrake or Cobra, but the DeZign bolts just show a bit "more".
Oh, I did try the WDP "Custom" bolt for a day - and returned it the next. It was WORSE than the stock bolt! And at NPS I had the guy there try the KAPP Diamond bolt - the darn pin BROKE OFF inside his gun! If you take a look at these, there are already stress cracks where the pin is in the body. These are not Delrin or ERTAlyte bolts, but some sort of polymer.
So, in conclusion, it seems that the DeZign bolts, though not as LP as the Cobra, was more consistent with its FPS per shot, and in the "blind" taste test, was the most liked. The Open Face the top, with his Venturi a close second.
Hope this helps you folks . . . .