Which Takes More Skill? (NXL , 7-Man)

[Bena]

NXL seems like the players just do what their told over and over again, no surprises really.

[acoenfam1]

I'm going to go out on a limb and say NPPL. Only because I've heard of NXL games turning into endurance contests.

[cky17]

i say 7 man, reason is if you lose a player that gives the other team points and takes points from you, xball you can lose 4 guys and still win with out points being taken away, so i think nppl needs alittle more skill, but i like xball so yeah.....

[MoogLe]

nppl, because there is no sideline coach exposing all the other team's moves to you

and yea the only thing that makes xball hard is the length of time you would have to play

[iPc-187]

^^^NPPL for all those reasons.....points can play a big role.....simple as that........although im not takin ANYTHIN away from those nxl'ers.......the endurance they got is pretty impressive

[morant]

more running and gunning in xball

and i think you guys are over estimating the sideline coaching....like it makes everything easier or somthing....
when you got a crowd screaming and coaches screaming and ppl screaming for you and against you and you can't tell who the hell to listen to or even hear who you are supposed to listen to it's not like it actually makes the game any easier.
xball and the point system makes the whole dynamic of the game change and players take bigger risks and work harder and faster and longer.

all in all it takes alot of skill to be a good paintballer in any formatt aside from the woods.

there are different skills that play different parts in various formats but i certianly don't think it takes any less of a player to be good at xball or on the flip side any better a player to be good at 5-7-10 man.

think of it this way...would you want to play 5man against say trauma or philly? do you think you would win?
i watched shock play in 5man at cup and they played 5 insanely fast you can tell xball has upped their game.

[JTp8ntballer12]

I think NPPL Because...
theres no sideline coachig to give away al of your mves that you practice so hard to learn. you have to comminicate your missing and tagged players, as well as positions, instead of having good ears. More teamwork.

I think Xball because
You have to have better edurance...games are alot longer.

Conclusion:
NPPL is harder

[topgunz_1]

I'm just agreeing with morant...that coach doesnt help much in xball, he has a tiny box and usually cant shout over the crowd...if you are on the crowd side and have good people over there helping, they can help you out alot though since they can move all the way with you. That can help a game turn, especially with the way the field was set at cup, those crowd side doritos turned many a game, I was there on both sides of the net.

tradition 5-7-10 man is difficult in requiring more on-field communication of the players and only 1 shot at victory or defeat.

both have strengths and weakness and require different skills, but one thing we can all agree on, its all a hell of a lot of fun

[theflash2k2]

nxl like morant and topgun said. and xball really takes the TRUE better team wins, eps playin bet of 3. coach hurts and helps. they can yell usefull stuff to u but a lot of time ull have some one with the other team just yellin bs to u. i remember the first time i played xball i wanst used to coachin and i tryed to make a 30 yard move that i could get away with playin 5man or 7man but then i get half way there i i hear from the sideline "hes comming up the middle!!!". thats when i knew i was screwed so i put a hand on my nuts and hulled @$$. but still got light up. and to be a good nxl team u have to pretty much have every one really athletic.

[JTp8ntballer12]

No...have you ever watched a xball game??? the coaches can give/take a game. NPPL finals are more organized now (best of 3 or 5)

eg (im using the strange - dynasty game at 2002 world cup)
AlexFragie Knows just when to move up and take out 3 players, that took years of work to know just the right time, strange didnt "sense" he was coming. In Xball the coach (and crowd) yells HES COMING DOWN THE TAPE" all three players look and shoot him.... i could do that...

and the true better team???
do you really think BL Ironmen (as they are known to me) and the AA (") are better than Afterchock or trauma?

they just have the best coaches (BL and something Garner)

[morant]

the best coaches in the NFL win as well....the coach is part of the team.

just like in other professional sports if you coach is losing you games it's time to get another one.

in that light the philly americans are indeed a better team than aftershock.

personally i like shock better but what can you do.

anybody who keeps up w/ football/baseball/ect. will tell you a coach can make or break a team...even if that team is full of talent.

[RaistlinsLegacy]

they are both pretty much equal, NPPL because you have to rely on yourself, however NXL tests one fitness....

[JTp8ntballer12]

morant you brought up a good point, but coaching dosent belong in Paintball. It does belong in Xball though, and Xball isnt paintball.

in football a coach isnt part of the "team" he is the coach.

[morant]

hmmmm....a football coach stands on the side of the field and yells at players...a football coach calls plays and basically tells the players what to do....if a football coach sucks his team loses...so um yeah, he is part of the team...maybe the most important part of the team...to say he's not is silly.
in fact a football team has multiple coaches and advisors and coordinators, to the point of guys sitting in booths high up in the stadium taking poloroid snapshot by the hundreds, assesing those and sending them to the coach on the field to make adjustments in game plans and various plays, to figure out why this team is killing you or why that one guy constantly runs all over you or maybe where the holes in the other teams defence is and how you can exploit it......tell me again how these ppl are not part of the team?

now.....i've been pretty peaceable about this so far and i'm going to try to be nice about this next part to but you really need to look at your stance on this jt.

"and Xball isnt paintball"
obviously xball is paintball and the closest thing i can relate that comment to is like stupid woodsballers who dis on speedballers who wear pajamas and play behind baloons.....
i work at a field, we cater to everybody...we have 50 acres of woods....we have 3 speedball fields....nobody at our field is allowed to dis oneanother......some ppl, not just newbie kids, don't like speedball for various reasons and would rather spend their time playing commando in the woods. some laugh at the prospect and think the woods suck....while speedball is obviously more of a sport than woodsball neither are any less 'paintball'.....go ask wayne dollack how his bank account looks after a few years of catering to woodsballers and try to tell him "that's not paintball"....in fact without woodsballers there would be no speedballers(it is still the case even today that woodsballers out number the rest of us by an overwhelming percentage and pumping $$$ into the industry that wants so badly to cater to the sporting side of the game).....thus the progression continues from speedballers to xball. while speedball is very much a sportslike to your average idiot it's still just a 'game' xball has taken it to yet another level and made it even more of a sport with the coaches and the clock and the over all feel of a real sporting event where spectators sit for prolonged periods of time to watch and yell and root for their favorite.
it's ok and completely acceptable to have a preferance of what kind of paintball you yourself likes to play the best, but, to dis one branch or the other is ignorant and slightly retarded, it's completely narrow minded and ppl with such additudes would suffocate the sport and the game and do nothing to accelerate it's growth.

to say xball is not paintball you may as well be saying there is no paintball except the kind 'I' play.....that is lame, it's weak, and at our field it's completely unacceptable.

you don't have to like it or even want to play it...nobody is going to tak regular old speedball away from you, but being narrowminded looks and sounds foolish to others and only weakens your own personality.

i'm not trying to be an @sshole or pick on you "jt" in particular....just trying to make a point.

[JTp8ntballer12]

football is totally different.... the coach can yell like wat?? "Good JOb, way to go" or give them plays....football has plays... paintball you dont have your coach say "hail mary, or double cuts..." in paintball u just go and play your pos, every LITTLE thing is not scripted, so the coach is not needed.

xball isnt paintball....its like saying cricket isnt baseball....there different yet so similar, someone good at baseball might be good at cricket but might not be...like in xball/paintball...

i think that your the one being narrowminded here, you have to think outside you little box.

xball has not taken paintball to the "next" level, just a differen level... some parts of xball may be better, like the quarters, and scoreboard, but the coaches take away from the skill of the players.. Great paintball players are no longer great xball players, if they were the same thing, players should be good at both...

[morant]

xballers are good at 5man....

paintball isn't the sport, "paintball" is whatever you do with markers and paintballs.....two 12yr olds in their back yard w/ talons is "paintball"....geeze how old are you?
according to your theory or wording speedball isn't paintball either it's SPEEDBALL or 7MAN or 5 or 10 or whatever...do you think the NPPL or PSP owns the word? is woodsball "paintball"?

what little box am i in?

did speed ball take "paintball" to the next level from the woods? or just a different level? "next" and "different" are synonymous in this discussion as the game of xball is the 'next' kind of developed formatt for "paintball" and 'different' from the last.

of course coaching in xball is different than coaching in football, or baseball, or baskettball because they are totally different sports. thus different methods of coaching. there are indeed preconcieved plays in football, so are there in xball....do you just assume when the philly americans decide to do a runthrough they just did it spur of the moment on the field in the middle of the fire? or do you suppose they planned it? it's a "play" or a perconcieved plan...each "game in xball is like a 'play' ............ in football a coach calls one play and his team lines up....then many possible scenarios occour....a coordinator sees that the other team has lined up in such a way that they are ready for said play...the coordinator relays this to the coach who screams a code to the quarterback who shouts it out before the snap to change the play they just called in the huddle....after the snap said plays unfold in one manner or the other. then they all do it again....slightly more going on than "good job"
do you really think an nfl coach does all his work in the locker room or on the practice field or dry erase board? NOT. you obviously know very little about how a football team opperates....and from you comments you seem to know very little about how an xball team opperates as well. and again you obviously overestimate just how much good the coach in xball telling you what to do coupled w/ the crowd and the netside ppl telling you what to do combined w/ what your teamates on field tell you combined w/ what you see and know on the field.....it's sensory overload at best....you really think a bunch of ppl screaming makes it an easier game?
as far as taking away from the "skill of the players".....that's silly too.
your thought:

Originally posted by JTp8ntballer12

AlexFragie Knows just when to move up and take out 3 players, that took years of work to know just the right time, strange didnt "sense" he was coming. In Xball the coach (and crowd) yells HES COMING DOWN THE TAPE" all three players look and shoot him.... i could do that...

do you actually think that negates fragie's skills? to me that means fragie has to work that much harder to pull off such a move to be able to do it.
it's not like the man was doing that stuff on his own even in 7-10man...he doesn't just magically know when to go...he listens to his team and follows the plan they have all carefully layed out ahead of time....
now he has to manage to do the same thing when everybody is screaming it.....just like in 7-10man sometimes it'll work and sometimes it wont, only now his running gunning and dodging skills are tested to the limit cus it just might not be a secret when it happens.

i'm on a five man team....we don't even play xball yet but it doesn't take a genius to figure out that it's a good formatt......i watched both strange an dynasty games and video taped them both and have watched them numerous times since....i've also seen and watched many other xball games and taken the time to analize the game and i just can't for the life of me see where the hell you are coming from..."it's not paintball" wtf? had you said i like 7 man better, well, thats fine, good for you....hell i like 5 man, i like 7 too and i'm not in any way trying to negate their validity as a good sport but neither am i bashing xball cus i refuse to try to understand it.

and it's not like saying "cricket isnt baseball" cus indeed crickett is not baseball...while they have many things in common they are not the same sport. they do not use the same balls or bats and the rules are different.....but then "baseball" is a significantly a different 'term' than "paintball". crickett IS NOT baseball but on the other hand football and "flag football" are both still "football"
it almost seems stupid that i need to explain this to you:
"paintball" in it's self is not a sport but rather a term that indicates an activity (or a ball) "paintball" encompases many activites that have to do w/ paintballs and the guns that shoot them.
24hr scenarios and woodsball in general are "paintball"
speedball albiet 10-7-5 or even recball days w/ 25 ppl on each side is "paintball"
xball is "paintball"
to state otherwise is foolish. one particular formatt does not own the title.
to enlighten your own thoughts in a more proper manner would be that:
coaching has no business in 7man(or any other form of speedball) but it does belong in xball.
'xball is not speedball' would be a correct phraze.

again what little box am i in?

once more i'm not an xballer...i play 5man....where coaches on the sidelines have no business......but i'm not dumb enough to think this is the only kind of paintball.

why do you think that all the really good pros are going to xball? why didn't dynasty simply go to cup as 10man this year and win....you know they could have.....ask some of them which game is easier to play. and again who won 5man pro-am this year? who did the best in general in 5man? xball teams...
i was at cup for 5 man early in the week and i watched shock play alot and the dogs too.....the most notable thing to me is that they didn't play the same way they used to....they played five man more fast and furious than they ever have in the past....xball has hightened their game....they played very 'dynasty style' speedball this year and they owned.

there are indeed pros and cons to both and some ppl will always like one better than the other either way and i am not in anyway trying to stifle anyone elses likes or dislikes. to each his own. but what kills me is ppl who are narrowminded enough to make judgements based on what they think or believe rather than what they know or took the time to fiugure out or reserch ......it's the same mentality as all the messageboard kiddies who argue about guns without knowing anymore than the mrof advertised.

the original question was what takes more skill 7man or xball?
some ppl voted and made their statement simply as i did. then some voted and posted ill thought out judgements made on their years of traumahead watching experience.
some of us obviously know more about the regular speedball formatt than about the xball formatt and would rather dismiss one rather than actually think about it or research it or watch it openmindedly and making a really valid assesment.

what little box am i in?

[morant]

one more thing you are not seeing...

in xball....the play/plan may be that "we need this point" so were going to try to elliminate 2 off the break and push the rest back in on the the left run through the left side to wrap it up...of course sometimes this doesn't work as planned and the players are forced to improvise and pull it out another way.

much like a football game where the coach decides it is indeed time for a hail mary.....sometimes for various reasons this doesn't work...maybe double coverage or somthing and again the players on the field are forced to improvise w/ a short screen or a first down pass to a fullback in the mid field or maybe the quarterback just has to tuck it and run. or just get sacked.

[JTp8ntballer12]

or you could just "need the game" yes i think fragies skill is taken away...sure fragie has to work harder, but then a coach could just say the same thing... just as long as the coach isnt blind..

paintball is a game that there is a flag, two opposing teams fight to capture the flag and take it...or just battle to elimination...does that say anything about quarters, pentanties and stuff added?? no.

coaches can help ppl in the locker room...like coaches can help AFTER the game... and then tell them what the players did wrong etc..

xball has made some teams more aggresive... so what? aggresive isnt always better. Aftershock, ironmen and dynasty were the best teams in paintball..there not the best xball teams now... because xball is a different type of game... tell me that if you were running up on the last guy and the coach said u were coming that that wouldnt take away your preformance..because you would get shot, when you shouldnt have.

read matty marshals article in the p8nt i got yesterday..it will help you understand.

and skill...i guess it really matter what type of player you are... if you need a coach to play and be good, then xball is your game... if you want to improve yourself and improve YOUR game..not the coaches, xball isnt for you, and so xball isnt for me.. id rather know i lost trying MY best than winning the wc knowing i couldnt have done it without someone on the sidelines telling me everything i should do...

im done talking now....

[dark2k2LCD]

when it comes down to it, they players still have be able to hit a guy and not get hit themselves.

However in nppl. you donthave soembody telling where they other team is

[JTp8ntballer12]

hey...if someone told me when someone was running i could defend against fraige/lang/or a bc rush... just about any player could..

i dont know tho im gunna drop this argument...it could go on forever...we just have 2 completely differet viewpoints and we will not accept the others...

[morant]

i have no problem w/ your view point....you are allowed to think that 7man takes more skill than xball and i don't have to agree w/ you and indeed i do not.....

my arguments lay in your insinuation that it's "not paintball" or that there is only one kind of paintball....your kind.
or that this is paintball or this isn't...

a good well detailed discussion about the pros & cons would have done more to help inform readers who don't know anything about it alot more good that a stoopid arguement
....unfortunately you never bit.

the long winded post were partly from my irritation at your narrow viewpoints (only seeing the one side and refusing any other angle) and in hopes of making you think a little before judging things(not just paintball).... you should always look at all angles of things before dismissing them, if you want or feel the need to discuss or argue a point you should have enough information or knowledge about said points to make a valid retort.
consider that a life lesson.

w/ that said i'm done picking on you and i will indeed let it rest....
truce.

[JTp8ntballer12]

i ve to back myselfup again now...

look on the first page, i did say why i thought xball and why i thought NPPL, i came to the conclusion of NPPL.

read the article in the 12 issue of p8nt i beleive, Richmond says xball isnt paintball, its a whole new game...

i see your point of view, just disagree with it, trust me, i have read, learned, and watched more Xball, NPPL than you have (played a LITTLE bit of xball), so dont tell me i dont have knowlege to back up what i say.

[morant]

"i have read, learned, and watched more Xball, NPPL than you have."

and there you go again making comments as if you actually know somthing when in fact you are simply guessing.

how indeed do you assume to know my paintball history?

[JTp8ntballer12]

well then dont assume that you have to teach me a lesson and think that i have less knowlege than you do, i have watched at least 2 dozen xball games every week since the LA Open, and nppl you can watch just about wherever. - so i assume that that is more xball than you have watched, and ive played it enough to know how much the coaches can turn a game around too.

[morant]

ok sport....10-4...no more lessons for you.
your a really smart guy and your reading learning an retention skills are continually on display in many threads on this board.